Thursday, October 7, 2010

Kardon Park? Really?

Is it possible for someone to tell me when this tract of land really became a park and not only that, but one with a name?  I have lived in Downingtown for over 15 years and I have never seen anyone make good use of what is being called Kardon Park.  Why is that?  Is it because people still tend to dump their unwanted materials there?  Or is it because it becomes a mud pit when it rains, or how about the fact that it wasn't even close to being an area that was sellable till they tore down the old building and put Rite Aid in?  What possibly could draw a person to this "park" to walk and enjoy nature?  I don't think it's the "wetlands" that were mentioned as we only have two heron that live near and around here....a white one and a blue one and of course a plethora of geese, but I do not think the geese will be too upset if we clean this area up and like anyone can go to another eating establishment or bar down the street if they don't like the one they are in the geese can manage to waddle over to The Ponds where I am sure the atmosphere is much more like "Cheers" in the respect as that's where everyone goes anyway.  The builder was willing to clean up the area and there were plans in the makings for some new traffic patterns and egress so that there would not be the suspected and complained about congestion.  Tax revenue would come into the borough which is sorely needed as many places do not see Downingtown as a mecca of growth and businesses are not first inclined to think of our little spot in the county.

     But it has come down to some judge on some bench that appears to think that this tract is really a park and is beneficial to everyone.....really?  So since that is the case I propose that the "Friends of Kardon Park" (I still have trouble saying that without either snickering or furrowing my brow) foot the cost of the toxic clean up and maintaining of the "park" so that they can stop pretending that something is really there when it's not.  Oh yeah and when you are done with that how about you hot foot it over to Johnsontown Park (one that really does exist by the way) and help us clean up our end of town where people could honestly benefit from someone helping us as we are working to actually raise the quality of life.  How about putting some effort into a worthwhile project?  There really is a park here with running water and residents here not some trumped up image of something you would like it to be.

There is no doubt there is beauty around this area as seen above on an early morning, but just turn around.....


  1. If you'd done some research or just read the local paper, you'd have found the reasons why the 50 acres were acquired and how it got the name Kardon Park.

    What do you think 'good use' of a passive park should be? Do you know what a passive park is?
    Hmm...Did you personally observe people dumping their trash into the park?

    How often do you walk through Kardon Park that you noticed there is a very high water table there?
    Does Johnsontown Park get saturated after a heavy rain? How often does Johnsontown get flooded?

    What does Rite Aid (formerly Echert) have to with Kardon Park?

    What do wetlands have to do with the Great Blue Heron and the Great Egret? Both these birds are migratory and usually do not stick around. Kardon Park and Beaver Creek are certainly blessed to have the Great Blues call this area 'home'

    For years, the USDA have been visiting the Borough each spring to addle or 'grease' the eggs. For that reason, the 'plethora' of Canada geese have not been a problem.

    The developer made quite a few promises that most likely are or would have been beyond her control.
    There was a promise to stop the flooding if Green Street Mews were built.
    There was also a promise to bring down or stabilize the taxes in the borough.
    For some reason, I doubt that new traffic patterns would have helped if the promise included as many as 700 more cars within the confines of 2.2 square miles of the Borough.

    To show even more ignorance, you mention Chester County Orphans' Court Judge Platt as 'some judge sitting on some bench.' Did you talk to anyone about the court case prior to writing this?
    Did you read ANYTHING in the Daily Local News about the case?

    Kardon Park cannot be sold. There is no reason to clean up soils that do not need cleaning.

    So, after you bad-mouthed both Kardon Park and Friends of Kardon Park, you have the audacity to ask that they come to Johnsontown Park and help you there? Friends of KP probably is the only group who may be able help you (I did sign a petition) There may be another environmental group, but....
    Do the research!

    Of course, it is the Borough's intention to cut that park in half and extend Boot Road through it which is not a good thing. All 13.5 acres of Johnsontown Park are important to the area and are worth saving.

  2. And had you really read what I said that mention of Johnsontown park was sarcastic. Yes I have watched people dump their trash In "Kardon Park". I have walked the trails and I have pctures of the sludge pnd that exists right in the midst of it. I did not ask them to come help as that kind of help we can do without. ROFL you asked if Johnsontown gets flooded...was that rhetorical because if it was not, does the fact that several people on Viaduct have to carry flood insurance on their houses which just so happen to but up against Johnsontown Park mean that it happens to be in a flood plain? The wetlands were mentioned in the DLN so that it what it has to do with it. You are the one sighting the newspaper so much maybe you should actually read what they say.

    Rite Aide is on some of the land that was formerly contaminated due to the manufactoring plant that resided there in the first place. Or did you not know that?

    Great so we have a contaminated area that no one is going to clean up used for a park.....k so you are going to go have a picnic there right about right next to the sludge pond? So the Friends of Kardon Park are going to spend every day walking those "paths" and enjoying what cannot be sold? That I seriously doubt.

  3. Not unlike Kardon Dump, Last Laugh has contaminated yet another site with its self centered, alarmist hysterics.
    Good God man, find a job, get a hobby, get out of the house!!! Passion, I understand, but you verge on obsession! Seek help.

  4. I'd like to know how long this development will keep taxes from going up. See I believe that you all lie to get what you want. I think that the very next year someone will want a tax increase for something in the borough. This I believe will also increase traffic in an already congested area. Look at what it's like coming down RT 30 toward RT 322. It takes a good 15 minutes to get through that light. And if you're coming out of a side street, forget it. And coming down RT 113 in the afternoon rush hour. You might as well bring a picnic basket.

  5. Love the scenic picture of a beautiful lake(there are three there, with wildlife and interesting backdrops)...and then three..count 'em, three of the silt trap above fourth lake.

    Really now, you could send a ten year-old out there with a camera, and he could find numerous attractive aspects of the park, the wildlife, the natural backdrop of the Lions trail, the people enjoying it, and put together a realistic album of the park. Likely he would not take pictures of the silt trap pond.

    This silt pond serves a very utilitarian purpose, it collects the debris that comes in the mill race...excess leaves, branches, trash, etc.....well it did when the race actually was running and was maintained by the borough...and prevents all that crap from going into the larger lakes, and sinking to the bottom, which would cost a lot to clean up. By trapping the stuff in the silt pond, it can easily be controlled and removed (if we had a council willing to do its job, that is).

    The photos on this site also serve a very utilitarian pupose: to misrepresent Kardon Park as a non-park, and to promote the agenda to develop it.

    Luckily, people can actually go out there and see the beauty of the park for themselves, and are not so stupid as to not see right through all the propaganda and blatant misrepresentation.

  6. Well gee the whole point was to show the contamination, so hmmm pictures of it might serve that purpose and if you actually read what was said instead of trying to figure out your argument you might have gotten the point. THE PONDS were not included in my shots because well darn it all they are actually a park, so what would be the point of including pictures of them?

    You seem to have your agenda and are pushing it is there a reason that I cannot state what I feel to be a misrepresentation of the area or does that only apply to those who don't want development in the area that will help out D'town in many ways?

  7. The silt trap is not evidence of the contamination in Kardon Park. The contamination is in the sub-surface soil. It is buried. You cannot take a picture of it.

    The pond you have taken three (3)...count-'em three pictures of is a catch basin for debris. Again it serves a utilitarian purpose, as does the air filter on your car. It is not supposed to look beautiful or even clean. It will only look that way immediately after it is cleaned and maintained, which the Borough will not do since they are trying to present the land as non-park.

    There are 40.5 acres of (confirmed by Judge Platt and all of the legal documentation) park, all of which would be worthy of pictures if you were trying to convey the true environment of the park.

    Taking 3 pictures of a silt trap pond, posting them on a web site, and claiming they are evidence of the contamination in the park is blatant misrepresentation, and you know it.

    The purpose of this web site is to promote YOUR agenda, and YOUR viewpoint, and has no basis in the reality that is Kardon Park.

  8. And while you might like to think you are right yet again you are completely wrong! I DID NOT represent the pictures of the sludge pond as part of the contamination, however it is part of the EYESORE! I stated under the pictures if you even bothered to look that there was beauty and then all you had to do is turn around.

    If you bothered to read anything other than the issue of Kardon Park there are other things that are part of our community that concern myself and several other people, but no you just latch onto Kardon Park not anything else and quite frankly I am a bit tired of your tirades. I won't censor you, but I do ask that you finally stop. Now since this happens to be something that I got involved in writing I would hope that it would contain my agenda and if anyone else in the community wishes to step up and write anything else they are quite welcome to and I will post it, but the "anonymous" postings of someone who just wishes to make themself look just that much bigger just makes them look that much smaller when they continue on and on.

  9. It is, in fact, your blog, and therefore you have every right to promote whatever you choose to promote.

    However, if you deliberately misrepresent something to promote your agenda, you will be called on it.

    [You might want to re-read your previous post, where you stated the pictures of the silt pond were to "show the contamination"]

    You are talking in circles, Elaine B.

  10. I apologize I mispoke meaning to say that the sludge pond is part of the eyesore. It is great that there are opposing opinions out there because that is all part of why we are still a Republic, but to hide behind an anonymous name and even when called on it, not come forth is a bit disingenuous.

  11. My name is not the relevant factor here. For that matter I do not know your name. Elaine B may or may not be your real name. It does not matter. What is important is the issue and how it is presented, which is why I've posted here.

    When you post opinions which denigrate good people like Ann Feldman, as "selfish", pursuing a personal agenda, etc. when the exact opposite is true, that is being disingenuous. It is the people trying to sell Kardon Park that have an agenda, and are putting their agenda in front of both their sworn responsibilities, and the interests of the people whose park they are the trustee for (as well as state law), not FOKP. Ann Feldman has stepped up and led the fight to stop the agenda of those people, and has both the law, and as far as anybody can tell, the support of a very significant percentage, if not the majority of Borough residents behind her.

    You have also denigrated the judge, who spent a year pouring over reams and reams of evidence to come to a fair decision. She allowed completely irrelevant testimony to be presented by the Borough and the developers, because, as she said in court, there would likely be an appeal, and she wanted everyone to have a chance to present their side. She did not have to do that, since most of it would not have been determinative. I suggest you visit the Orphans Court and ask to see the evidence file. It is huge.

    You have also managed to completely dismiss the value of a popular public park, based on misinformation and blatant misrepresentation. I will give you the benefit of the doubt that perhaps you were swayed by the misinformation presented by the proponents in Council meetings, and the DMSA literature, but now that it has been shown by numerous people and by the judge's decision to be deliberately misleading and mostly untrue, there is no point in repeating it.

    Having an opinion is one thing. If you were just saying I don't like Kardon Park, and I think housing would be better for that site than park land, I have no issue with that. But to declare half the park is off-limits, too dangerous to walk on, an eyesore, etc. is self-serving and not supported by either the facts or the experience of thirty some years of park users' experience. Most people who use the park would never even see the silt pond you have featured so prominently, since it is north of fourth lake. They would have to enter at the silt pond to see it, and that entrance point leads nowhere. It is the service entrance for it.

    There are three major parks in Downingtown. Kerr, Kardon, and Johnsontown, Two thirds (66%) of them are under immediate and serious threat of being drastically compromised by the current council. Now that is an agenda. At least they don't have their eyes on Kerr Park...yet. They even talked at one point about filling in First Lake, and developing there. Who in their right mind would have an agenda like this and think there would not be opposition?

  12. There, there is your post. Happy now? I had to drag it out of the SPAM folder. I shall address your rantings later, especially since I live near one of the parks you are stating are under attack, but we as a community are taking a completely different approach than FOKP and we are getting much further along than a dog fight.

  13. Good luck with dealing with a council that seems committed to bulldozing a road through the middle of Johnsontown Park. I've been told they want to move the park to the train yard. (a contaminated site)

    Regardless, the proposal for Johnsontown Park is for a public purpose, a public road to relieve traffic congestion and provide alternate routes for traffic, which is a far cry from just selling it to a developer to make a buck.

    I am sure the Council members are saying all sorts of nice things to your group, but will that change the course of events? Not if they are committed to the idea. Even if the plan goes through, they could easily replace Johnsontown Park at the train yard with an equal amount of acreage. There would be no loss of parkland, nor is there anything unique about that park. It is basically a large lawn, which could be re-created anywhere. Kardon park would be reduced by half, and would cease to be the type of park it was envisioned to be by the Council that fought a four year legal battle to get it in the first place, and prevent townhouses from being built there.

    My guess is that if you really wanted to stop the Johnsontown plan you would find yourself in the exact place that FOKP found themselves, which is to resort to legal action based on the Public Trust Doctrine and the DDPA. Based on existing case law, the park could not be sold even for a public purpose (such as a firehouse, or municipal storage building)if it is a dedicated public park. There may be some wiggle room for the Borough for public streets, though.

  14. Posting under the name "Elaine B." is grounds for calling someone else out for hiding behind their anonymity? You were only kidding, right?

  15. I was not kidding. People know exactly who I am. I have not hidden anything from anyone...well except maybe my pin number to my bank account, but then again if someone wanted that I am sure there would be a way to get it. They would find funds very low, but hey if a Happy Meal would make your day go for it.

  16. Who should I vote for on November 8th?

  17. Anonymous you asked who you should vote for in November......that is entirely up to you. Each candidate has their strong points. Nick Winkler is running unopposed in the West End. Matt Zaun, Alex Rakoff and Cara DeStephano are running for two seats in the East End. My thoughts are look to the candidates who have been above board with their ideas and not undermining the others. If you live on the East end of the borough, look to the ones who have not built their campaigns and resumes on empty groups, and thoughts that they are the best candidate simply because they head a group or founded one that does little if anything. I live on the West end of town and have supported Nick throughout and there is a blog about Matt Zaun that is recent here at this site. Gatehr your info and then make your decision.

  18. Downingtown has been blessed with a significant amount of parkland within the borough. Kardon Park, a plot of land in the floodplain of the historic Brandywine River is now in the process of being auctioned off to the highest bidder. Let’s hope that Downingtown is also blessed with a citizenry which appreciates the value of public spaces and not controlled by real estate developers who will merely exclude the public of their right.

  19. I appreciate that you are reading the blog, but a little late to the party aren't you? This plot of land has been tied up in litigation so long that I think in the long run not many people give a hoot anymore. I think it would serve both parties if they stopped the nonsense and get back to taking care of the borough.